Linnets' Fans' Forum

General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Gordon Chilvers on June 08, 2021, 08:36:27 PM

Title: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Gordon Chilvers on June 08, 2021, 08:36:27 PM
Been very reliably informed that the U21/Ressies has had the plug pulled on them. So whats the good of telling all these youngsters to join the academy if you want to play for KLTFC. What chance is there of being elevated straight into the 1st team directly from say the U19s? Surely if a player is that good he will be scouted by someone far bigger than Kings Lynn.
Sad day, the last time this happened i believe was under the Gary Mills leadership.
On thge plus side the teams such as Fakenham, Swaffham, Downham etc will surely benefit from this folly.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 08, 2021, 09:22:02 PM
Be interesting to hear the official line on this one.

I wonder if something has got lost in translation. :dontknow:

Previous rumours were that they were not joining a league, but just playing other Academy teams.

Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 08, 2021, 09:26:38 PM
Based on what youíve just said I personally canít see how removing a team playing at Step 6 is going to influence anyoneís decision on signing up to the Academy? My kids went and it wouldnít affect my choice of whether to do it or not. Of course I do understand what youíre saying about their being no bridge between 19s and First Team, but before everyone starts getting negative, we donít actually know whatís being discussed behind closed doors. Canít imagine it would be done without a plan in place. 
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 08, 2021, 09:27:36 PM
Nothing in the Thurlow Nunn League website about this.

Stephen Cleeve has been a big advocate of having a successful Youth set up at the club with a clear path to the first team.   So cannot believe the rug would be pulled on having a team in the ECL, step 6 Football
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 08, 2021, 09:35:09 PM
Beardsmore you seem to be speaking as someone very close to the Youth set up so surely you would have been consulted and asked for your opinion ?

Which is ......, scrap it or go with it ?
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 08, 2021, 09:35:37 PM
More money bring switched to the first team budget?  :dontknow:

I suppose they are the Clubs shop window, and the Club has appeared as a one team club for quite a while now (imho).

What next though? Presumably the Academy earns the Club a lot of money. While that continues, I guess they're safe.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 08, 2021, 09:40:22 PM
Beardsmore you seem to be speaking as someone very close to the Youth set up so surely you would have been consulted and asked for your opinion ?

Which is ......, scrap it or go with it ?

I went to the trials back in April/May whenever it was. So would obviously understand concerns, but it really wouldnít influence whether I signed mine up or not. Itís all opinions though i guess, some may have the complete opposite view. Iíd imagine if we looked into it, not many clubs at this level have a team playing at that step in the ladder? But could be wrong
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 08, 2021, 09:41:38 PM
Thatís somewhat blinkered B&G.   Surely if you have decent talent coming through you want to reap the benefit not see players leaving to join other clubs who can help their development by playing senior menís football. 

The likes of Norwich ( and many pro clubs) send academy players out on loan to gain. Experience of playing in competitive games rather that the less physical type of game they become accustomed to in age group Football.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Ap on June 08, 2021, 10:27:15 PM
Been very reliably informed that the U21/Ressies has had the plug pulled on them. So whats the good of telling all these youngsters to join the academy if you want to play for KLTFC. What chance is there of being elevated straight into the 1st team directly from say the U19s? Surely if a player is that good he will be scouted by someone far bigger than Kings Lynn.
Sad day, the last time this happened i believe was under the Gary Mills leadership.
On thge plus side the teams such as Fakenham, Swaffham, Downham etc will surely benefit from this folly.

Pretty sure it was during the Peter Morris era that the club decided to run without a reserve side. A reserve team had returned during Gary Mills' tenure, playing in the UCL reserve divisions, with Paul Ramsey in a player-coach role I believe.

https://fchd.info/KINGSL2.HTM


Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 08, 2021, 10:31:24 PM
Think we just need to wait and see what the official line is, but personally as I have said before on here, I see little point in having a ressie/u21 side in the Thurlow Nunn.......the gap is way too big from there to NL. So to me , having the Academy playing other Academies and scrapping entry in the Thurlow Nunn makes perfect sense.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 08, 2021, 10:39:00 PM
Think we just need to wait and see what the official line is, but personally as I have said before on here, I see little point in having a ressie/u21 side in the Thurlow Nunn.......the gap is way too big from there to NL. So to me , having the Academy playing other Academies and scrapping entry in the Thurlow Nunn makes perfect sense.

Completely agree with this re the size of the gap. As sad as it is to see it removed, for the bigger picture itís the right move by the club now theyíre operating at NL level.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 08, 2021, 11:00:25 PM
Think we just need to wait and see what the official line is, but personally as I have said before on here, I see little point in having a ressie/u21 side in the Thurlow Nunn.......the gap is way too big from there to NL. So to me , having the Academy playing other Academies and scrapping entry in the Thurlow Nunn makes perfect sense.

Completely agree with this re the size of the gap. As sad as it is to see it removed, for the bigger picture itís the right move by the club now theyíre operating at NL level.

Are you saying the rumour is true?  :dontknow:
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 08, 2021, 11:09:07 PM
Think we just need to wait and see what the official line is, but personally as I have said before on here, I see little point in having a ressie/u21 side in the Thurlow Nunn.......the gap is way too big from there to NL. So to me , having the Academy playing other Academies and scrapping entry in the Thurlow Nunn makes perfect sense.

Completely agree with this re the size of the gap. As sad as it is to see it removed, for the bigger picture itís the right move by the club now theyíre operating at NL level.

Are you saying the rumour is true?  :dontknow:

If Mr Chilvers sources are as reliable as he mentions, which Iím assuming they must be for him to feel confident enough to post about it. Then the rumour appears to be true. But letís wait and see! Could all be terrace talk as they say
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 09, 2021, 06:21:23 AM
If, true a very sad day for the Club.

The Reserve team has produced some good players for the Club when in the hands of some excellent coaches like Backie and Keith Rudd etc.  Maybe the current incumbents are not of the required standard ?
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: gs50 on June 09, 2021, 07:52:11 AM
Name some players over the years who came through  reserves.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 09, 2021, 07:59:10 AM
No reason why the Academy set up can't do the same........ it's just a name at the end of the day.

So for the club I think it makes perfect sense........no use comparing with the good old days........."the times they are a changing".........indeed HAVE changed

My only concern would be that there needs to be a vehicle for Lynn youngsters who  are around Thurlow Nunn standard to play at that level.........but I am sure something will spring up over time.

However, I don't feel it should be incumbent on the club to provide this. Mr C's comment above about losing talent to the likes of Fakenham etc, indicates to me that maybe something new does need to form..........KLTFC are no.longer a little local entity and probably can't afford to spread their cloth so thinly to cover such bases in current climes, I would respectfully suggest.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: admin on June 09, 2021, 09:03:49 AM
Club statement:
"As part of a restructure process within the football department the decision has been taken to withdraw the clubís teams from both the Thurlow Nunn Football League (step 6) and the Thurlow Nunn Youth League competitions with immediate effect.

The football club formally informed the Thurlow Nunn League of itís decision to withdraw itís teams from both of their competitions by e-mail late on Monday evening, with the club receiving formal acknowledgement by return e-mail from the league late Tuesday afternoon.

The decision has not been taken lightly, with the lack of a venue to both play and train for matches being a major stumbling block. Another reason is the fact that most of the players for both teams either are or will be enrolled in the clubís highly successful Academy partnership with KES which will see an Under 19ís team competing in the National Leagueís Under 19 Alliance competition, meaning we wouldnít have the resources to compete in all competitions in a way which would effectively benefit all players. The Academy side will represent the club in next seasonís FA Youth Cup competition.

The club will ,of course, do all they can within their powers to assist the small number of players who are left without a club following the decision made."
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 09, 2021, 09:21:35 AM
Think that's fairly comprehensive.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 09, 2021, 09:28:08 AM
https://www.lynnnews.co.uk/sport/linnets-scrap-under-21-and-youth-teams-in-playing-restructur-9202536/
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 09, 2021, 02:06:07 PM
How many of last years Reserve team are now not part of this yearís Academy?
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Nemesis on June 09, 2021, 02:43:41 PM
I assume Joe Gascoigne and Flo are too old so would either find another club or go out on loan?
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 09, 2021, 03:52:39 PM
How many of last years Reserve team are now not part of this yearís Academy?

Yes will be interesting to find out.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Ap on June 09, 2021, 04:54:33 PM
Name some players over the years who came through  reserves.

Mark Howard 80s Andy Hunt 90s both went on to play football league.

Defty bros would have played a lot of res football before breaking into the first team.

We've also seen many reserves step up to effectively become the first team for short or not so short spells over the years when a manager has left and a large swathe of his first team have followed him!

But as others have said never has the gap between first and reserves in terms of divisions been as great as it is now. How many other full time National league sides have a second string playing in a step 6 league? The times are a changing at the Walks for sure.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: TonyM on June 09, 2021, 05:21:40 PM
Seems a reasonable decision based on the modern football landscape, if anything it is probably a year or two too late - very few of our counterparts at NLN had reserve sides, not even the full time outfits.  As others have said the gap it too wide between step 6 and step 1/2 and far better for a promising academy player to go out on loan to step 3 for a season than play a year at step 6 with the (slim) possibility of getting the odd game on the bench.  Thus if the reserves aren't in a position to provide a viable stepping stone for players then you can reasonably ask what is the point of running them?
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Dazzarugby65 on June 09, 2021, 06:54:36 PM
 :
Name some players over the years who came through  reserves.

Mark Howard 80s Andy Hunt 90s both went on to play football league.

Defty bros would have played a lot of res football before breaking into the first team.

We've also seen many reserves step up to effectively become the first team for short or not so short spells over the years when a manager has left and a large swathe of his first team have followed him!

But as others have said never has the gap between first and reserves in terms of divisions been as great as it is now. How many other full time National league sides have a second string playing in a step 6 league? The times are a changing at the Walks for sure.

 :farmer: :oldman" Shaun Frowhawk, many reserve games and a few for the 1st team.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 09, 2021, 08:37:08 PM
Right or wrong probably depends on what people's opinions are regarding what a Reserve team is for.

If its solely there as a stepping stone to first team football, then yes the gap is too big.

A club that claims it works in, and is an important part of the community, may look at things differently.

I would also assume that Academy teams not taking part in a league, would earn the Club money.

A Reserve team playing in Thurlow Nunn would presumably cost the Club money.

Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Gordon Chilvers on June 09, 2021, 08:58:37 PM
Name some players over the years who came through  reserves.
Dom Dwyer USA international, Mark Heath Preston and the lad Nicholls now enjoying an amazing lifestyle in the States. Just to name a few.

Mark Howard 80s Andy Hunt 90s both went on to play football league.

Defty bros would have played a lot of res football before breaking into the first team.

We've also seen many reserves step up to effectively become the first team for short or not so short spells over the years when a manager has left and a large swathe of his first team have followed him!

But as others have said never has the gap between first and reserves in terms of divisions been as great as it is now. How many other full time National league sides have a second string playing in a step 6 league? The times are a changing at the Walks for sure.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 09, 2021, 09:29:55 PM
"At the end of the day Saint," it all boils down to change... people generally tend to be resistant to change when it upsets their long established view of how things should ideally be.

A combination of successive promotions and the impacts of Covid are presenting clubs and fans alike with plenty of challenges, as things inevitably have to be "re-set".
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 09, 2021, 09:43:53 PM
Interestingly if you use the Andy Hunt scenario he would have never played for Lynn with todayís MO.

He was too old for the Academy and with no Reserve team in place he would have had to play his football elsewhere before moving into the Professional game with Newcastle, West Brom and Charlton.

Be interesting to understand what the powers that be deem will be classed as successful with the Academy.

Would value Beardsmore opinion on that one.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: gs50 on June 09, 2021, 10:05:01 PM
If I remember correctly Andy Hunt went  straight  into  the first team and didn't play many before he went to Kettering. As a good guide Carey came to us at 19 so finishing at under 19s should be OK.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 09, 2021, 10:29:38 PM
GS your memory is letting you down.  Andy Hunt played for the Reserves when he joined from his home village of Ashill.   He then started the following season in the first team under Alan Day.   Peter Morris then took him to Kettering for a fee, after only playing a few first team games.

He also had trials at Norwich who turned him down. 
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 09, 2021, 10:48:17 PM
I donít really see it as a fair comparison with some of these names being chucked around. The reserves at the point of say Mark and Dom were at Step 5 and the First Team probably Step 3? Not really the same as National League to Thurlow Nunn Division. The gap in levels is a lot bigger these days.
I also donít think youíll find many NL clubs who use their Reserves side to be part of the community? In my opinion if the Reserves side is of no benefit to the First Team, then explore other options. Which seems to be whatís happening here.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 10, 2021, 08:38:58 AM
I also donít think youíll find many NL clubs who use their Reserves side to be part of the community?

Really? That's a shame then.

At Lynn there has always been a lot of local players representing Reserves. Therefore I would suggest that was at least part of the Club being part of the Community.

You probably weren't around when Chapman tried to get rid of Reseves team, or to see how local people and sponsors rallied around to ensure reserve football survived.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 10, 2021, 08:53:42 AM
Buster was clever enough not to go against public opinion.   Thatís why he is the top Sports Promoter in the area.


Most clubs seem to run with an U21 side for players to step up from the Academy.  Is that vital step about to be put in place at Lynn ?.   If the gap is too big between Step 6 and step 1 then surely the same will apply to the step between the Academy and Step 1?
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 10, 2021, 11:21:04 AM
I also donít think youíll find many NL clubs who use their Reserves side to be part of the community?

Really? That's a shame then.

At Lynn there has always been a lot of local players representing Reserves. Therefore I would suggest that was at least part of the Club being part of the Community.

You probably weren't around when Chapman tried to get rid of Reseves team, or to see how local people and sponsors rallied around to ensure reserve football survived.

What I mean is I doubt many NL teams are thinking ďwell we better have a reserve side to keep the community happyĒ. Canít imagine thatís at the forefront of their thought process. Itís whatís best for the club at the end of the day and If this is the way forward for them then letís see how it goes.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 10, 2021, 12:12:08 PM
What I mean is I doubt many NL teams are thinking ďwell we better have a reserve side to keep the community happyĒ. Canít imagine thatís at the forefront of their thought process.

I'm sure your 100% correct on that one. That's nothing to be proud of though.



Itís whatís best for the club at the end of the day and If this is the way forward for them then letís see how it goes.


Maybe. I guess that must be the Owners thinking and personal opinion behind this decision. Desperate times call for desperate measures and all that. Short term thinking as far as I'm concerned though.

Also, its not just a case of players coming through to first team. The Academy is partly living off of the Reserves history. Some of the senior figures involved with the Academy had lengthy and successful years with Reserves which the Academy will now benefit from. Where are the future likes of Stuart going to come from now?   :dontknow:

Reserves were full of local players. The Walks Stadium is a local asset which the Clubs gets at a Peppercorn rent. I bet the other NL Clubs that you mention look on in envy at the low costs that Lynn have compared to them when it comes to Stadium costs. Would the Academy even exist if the Club had to pay full market rate (maybe even the Club  :dontknow: ) For this reason alone, the Club should support local players and have a proper Reserves team.


Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: gs50 on June 10, 2021, 12:30:38 PM
Thought one of main reasons for not having reserve side was there is no where for them to play.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 10, 2021, 01:12:34 PM
What I mean is I doubt many NL teams are thinking ďwell we better have a reserve side to keep the community happyĒ. Canít imagine thatís at the forefront of their thought process.

I'm sure your 100% correct on that one. That's nothing to be proud of though.



Itís whatís best for the club at the end of the day and If this is the way forward for them then letís see how it goes.


Maybe. I guess that must be the Owners thinking and personal opinion behind this decision. Desperate times call for desperate measures and all that. Short term thinking as far as I'm concerned though.

Also, its not just a case of players coming through to first team. The Academy is partly living off of the Reserves history. Some of the senior figures involved with the Academy had lengthy and successful years with Reserves which the Academy will now benefit from. Where are the future likes of Stuart going to come from now?   :dontknow:

Reserves were full of local players. The Walks Stadium is a local asset which the Clubs gets at a Peppercorn rent. I bet the other NL Clubs that you mention look on in envy at the low costs that Lynn have compared to them when it comes to Stadium costs. Would the Academy even exist if the Club had to pay full market rate (maybe even the Club  :dontknow: ) For this reason alone, the Club should support local players and have a proper Reserves team.

To be honest Iím sure youíd find 99% of the time a Reserve side is there to support the first team and also to get the experience needed to make the step up. As it stands now, the step  is too big and therefore it doesnít serve much benefit. Previous years I could fully accept that it was worthwhile. You canít just run a reserve side for the sole purpose of keeping the community happy.

But anyway as others and myself have said previously, we donít actually know the longer term plan yet. Just seems to be everyone is instantly negative no matter what happens.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 10, 2021, 04:04:50 PM
Beard Iím sure you understand the sense of loss with something that has very much been part of the Club for many years that involved local
Lads, who were someoneís son, grandson, nephew etc and the sense of pride that brought.

To have it all wiped out in a flick of a pen is I guess upsetting for some.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 10, 2021, 08:15:08 PM
You canít just run a reserve side for the sole purpose of keeping the community happy.


Nobody claimed you could or should.  :dontknow:
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 10, 2021, 08:46:35 PM
I completely agree with your posts Beardsmore and am wading in to help as you seem to be being ambushed by my good forum friends Mall and B & G  :laughcry: :laughcry:

Bottom line guys is that holding on to the past and being sentimental won't see the club survive at this level. This is a time for tough choices and the club has just made one which makes excellent sense on a number of levels.

It's obvious that a Thurlow Nunn side is of little use as a feeder to a NL side ....and to keep something going just because it always used to be there is not realistic.

I feel sure that something will arise out if the ashes to still make parents proud of their lads, as Mallard puts it....but there is no good reason for it to be connected with KLTFC any more.

KLTFC can be very much a Community Club without fielding a step 6 reserve side B & G..... it's time to move on and fully embrace where the club now is........some people still haven't caught up IMHO  :laughcry:
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 10, 2021, 08:56:03 PM
KES, of course itís disappointing to see old traditions being lost along the way.  I make no apologies for wanting to see them survive.  Thatís what we were use to. 

So with the new U19 squad that will be developed each year will that gap from that level of games to First team Football not be even greater than it would when we had a Reserve team ?

KES you seem a wise old sage.  Help me out here.  I did ask Beard but he didnít seem very forthcoming with the ideas for the  way forward in terms of what is deemed successful.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 10, 2021, 09:25:27 PM
Hi Mall.......... I think that Academy players, playing against lads from other club's academies has been the way of things in the upper echelons of Non league for some time now.
With Lynn's meteoric rise in the last few seasons, we have all been catapulted into a new field...and naturally it takes time for us to adjust....... however we do have to adjust, if we are to survive and be competitive. I have seen a fair share of Ressies matches at The Walks and can recognise the pain that some feel at losing them, but we have to understand that we are about to move into a completely new, full time era.

Local lads need an outlet, a local team to play for and I suspect something will develop, given how passionately people feel about the need. With the intention of trying to get the first team to play a particular brand of football at NL level, comes the need for a decent playing surface and it seems a tipping point has been reached, where there is too much demand on the precious Walks surface.

It seems unlikely that Lynn will leave The Walks anytime soon, so maybe the local lads who are not part of the Academy need a new venue and a new 'umbrella' to move forward under........I have a feeling that there is sufficient passion around the town, for something to form in the not too distant.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Beardsmore80 on June 10, 2021, 10:04:45 PM
KES, of course itís disappointing to see old traditions being lost along the way.  I make no apologies for wanting to see them survive.  Thatís what we were use to. 

So with the new U19 squad that will be developed each year will that gap from that level of games to First team Football not be even greater than it would when we had a Reserve team ?

KES you seem a wise old sage.  Help me out here.  I did ask Beard but he didnít seem very forthcoming with the ideas for the  way forward in terms of what is deemed successful.

Apologies, wasnít intentional. What exactly was it that you asked? Iím being lazy instead of finding the post.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 10, 2021, 10:35:02 PM
It seems unlikely that Lynn will leave The Walks anytime soon, so maybe the local lads who are not part of the Academy need a new venue and a new 'umbrella' to move forward under........I have a feeling that there is sufficient passion around the town, for something to form in the not too distant.

A Club creating its own competition?  :dontknow:

That doesn't seem to be a very wise thing to do!
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 11, 2021, 08:06:49 AM
Wasn't advocating the club creating anything in termsof the ressies........think someone else from outside will set something up....... unlikely to be in competition with the club as the levels are quite distinct and in any case there have always been alternatives for young lynn players...they haven't all found themselves in the reserves...lots of local teams to choose from.....and btw no need for this to turn into a them and us situation with people feeling bitter for eons........ surely people can see where the club is coming from...it has to pull its limited resources together and adjust to survive.... hopefully any new set up for reserve level players will be on good terms with the club. IMO a bit sad that people seem not to be able to appreciate that...really hope people are not going to remain bitter and squabble about this long term......... it's atime for people to rally around and stay positive
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blueboy on June 11, 2021, 08:42:55 AM
Everything is probably fine as things stand at the moment  but what happens if the club suffers a massive fall and gets a double relegation? Obviously we/I hope they don't, but stranger things have happened.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 11, 2021, 09:21:48 AM
Wasn't advocating the club creating anything in termsof the ressies........think someone else from outside will set something up....... unlikely to be in competition with the club as the levels are quite distinct.

I didn't think that you were advocating the Club does something. What I meant is if someone did set up another Club, it would have come about due to the Club deciding they didn't want a Reserve team.

Any football played locally is in competition with Lynn, irrespective of the different levels. If one person decides he would like to go to Heacham rather than Lynn, that's £20 plus that Lynn don't receive. With the Reserves following over the years, combined with other matters, I think you could be looking at nearer the 100 figure initially if a another Club was formed. Depending on success that figure could increase. That's serious money.

I wouldn't worry about it too much though...............I can't see it happening any time soon.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 11, 2021, 10:12:19 AM
Thanks for the clarification B & G.

My personal take on it is this.

The Walks facility cannot now really support a reserves team.

As the first team progress, the club will hopefully attract many new fans and lose a few.

Hopefully people will get behind the Academy side.

If people would prefer to go to watch a rehashed Lynn reserves away from The Walks, then that is their prerogative.

Lost revenue......100at say £10 times 20 matches is £20,000 less salary costs, travel to away matches, kit costs etc...... personally don't think that's a huge financial loss for a successful NL side to bear. If you compare that, to say, the costs already spent on the pitch
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Blue_and_Gold on June 11, 2021, 11:45:58 AM

Lost revenue......100at say £10 times 20 matches is £20,000 less salary costs, travel to away matches, kit costs etc...... personally don't think that's a huge financial loss for a successful NL side to bear.

Just to clarify this. I meant if they went to see another team instead of Lynn's first team, so we would be talking well over twice the amount you mention.


Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 11, 2021, 12:04:10 PM
If they are going to see another team instead of KLTFC, all because Lynn suddenly have no reserves, then that seems a strange logic to me......but if they would rather not watch arguably the best side Lynn have had, in the best league they have been in, managed by the best manager Lynn have had, against the best sides in non league, watched by the biggest crowds (Covid permitting) at The Walks for a generation, then again that's their choice.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 11, 2021, 04:26:34 PM
Iím sorry for appearing to be thick, but how goes a lad plying his trade in the academy make the overnight leap to Non League Step one.  Surely if the gap between the Reserves to the first time is massive ( it is). Then does the same not apply to gap between the academy and the first team or am I missing something ?

It seems a lot of clubs work with an U23ís as a bridge between the two.  Are Lynn looking to follow this MO ?

Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: TonyM on June 11, 2021, 05:19:59 PM
Iím sorry for appearing to be thick, but how goes a lad plying his trade in the academy make the overnight leap to Non League Step one.  Surely if the gap between the Reserves to the first time is massive ( it is). Then does the same not apply to gap between the academy and the first team or am I missing something ?

It seems a lot of clubs work with an U23ís as a bridge between the two.  Are Lynn looking to follow this MO ?

I don't think anyone is suggesting players will be able to bridge that gap overnight, I assume that if a lad shows enough about them that the club could sign them for an additional year after the academy and then loan them out to (say) a step 3 to gain more experience and then take a view on them twelve months down the line.  I guess this would only be a maximum of a couple of lads per year and would have the benefit to the player of playing at a higher level than if they were to stay and play in the reserves @ step 6 and the club would only be investing in those that it thought had the potential to develop with the club longer term.  I think an u23s would be an expensive option for a step 1/2 club, fine for Norwich as they are starting with players 'more likely to turn pro' but even they tend to loan out players as part of their development.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 11, 2021, 06:02:39 PM
Letís hope this latest idea produces the goods itís supposed to.   Canít help thinking young players development would be helped by playing in ĎMenísí football. 
 Like you say Tone, Clubs like Norwich loan out even their U23ís to gain valuable experience  that they seemingly cannot get within age group football.

I hope the Academy set up is not being used as a fund raiser for the First team as some are suggesting.

The old saying the proof of the pudding is in the eating letís see what starts to roll of the production.  Or not, as the case maybe.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: TonyM on June 11, 2021, 06:19:39 PM
Letís hope this latest idea produces the goods itís supposed to.   Canít help thinking young players development would be helped by playing in ĎMenísí football. 
 Like you say Tone, Clubs like Norwich loan out even their U23ís to gain valuable experience  that they seemingly cannot get within age group football.

I hope the Academy set up is not being used as a fund raiser for the First team as some are suggesting.

The old saying the proof of the pudding is in the eating letís see what starts to roll of the production.  Or not, as the case maybe.

I think the issue is that the landscape has completely changed for player development in the past decade.  The bigger professional teams now hoover up far more players than they did previously but given that there is still a finite (and maybe reducing) number of professional contracts on offer there is a fairly high attrition rate at 16, 18 and 23.  By this measure Lynn are very unlikely to have a crop of players who are destined for the professional game but an academy for 16-18 can work as Dereham have shown - brings in a bit of cash for the club, allows players to develop and train for a career (although not necessarily as a professional football player) and might bring in a player or two into the first team.  To my mind that is a win-win situation between player and club but anyone hoping for a Norwich style academy with loads of players going professional (step 1 or EFL) football is probably going to be disappointed
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Mallard on June 11, 2021, 07:15:43 PM
There lies the issue Tone.  Big Clubs like Norwich, Peterborough are hoovering up 100ís of kids from area, age 9 onwards.   They have so much to offer facility wide and Ďdreamíwise.

Why would a ĎReserveí side trading under another name not be able to self finance and push up through Non League Football closer to the first team step one and maybe work on the principle of an Ďolderí age type academy.   Something along the lines of what Glenn Hoddle ran in Spain.   In fact I think a certain George Thompson came through from there.

Just throwing that into the mix, as something that might have more advantage to the first team playing at Step 1
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 11, 2021, 09:18:35 PM
Where do you envisage this team that are going to rise through the steps playing tho Mall, when there isn't "room" at The Walks. I am not personally aware of any team that has played at The Walks having been self financing, even with the cheap deal on the ground (though I am willing to be proved wrong).

Going back to the Academy set up, I believe there is greater opportunity for youngsters to develop than with the old reserve set up. Playing against other Academy sides (some stronger, some weaker) gives an opportunity for lads to assess their progress against others of a similar age and also gives the opportunity for" lateral movement" between clubs at the end of The Academy term.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Gordon Chilvers on June 11, 2021, 09:47:19 PM
Everything is probably fine as things stand at the moment  but what happens if the club suffers a massive fall and gets a double relegation? Obviously we/I hope they don't, but stranger things have happened.
the rise and fall of Boston United and Lowestoft Town are clear examples
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Gordon Chilvers on June 11, 2021, 09:56:18 PM
Thanks for the clarification B & G.

My personal take on it is this.

The Walks facility cannot now really support a reserves team.

As the first team progress, the club will hopefully attract many new fans and lose a few.

Hopefully people will get behind the Academy side.

If people would prefer to go to watch a rehashed Lynn reserves away from The Walks, then that is their prerogative.

Lost revenue......100at say £10 times 20 matches is £20,000 less salary costs, travel to away matches, kit costs etc...... personally don't think that's a huge financial loss for a successful NL side to bear. If you compare that, to say, the costs already spent on the pitch
For one Kes kit cost does not come into it. FREE kit is normally part of the kit deals (matchday kit, training kit, travel kit, management, coaches, kitman etc included with the likes of Kappa, O'Neills, DEFINITELY Joma from my time as the go between. Yours eyes would water if you new how much those deals came to. Then had the gaul to demand more free kit to sell at retail in the clubshop and online.
I still have a copy of the JOMA contract! Very interesting reading.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: Gordon Chilvers on June 11, 2021, 10:03:17 PM
Where do you envisage this team that are going to rise through the steps playing tho Mall, when there isn't "room" at The Walks. I am not personally aware of any team that has played at The Walks having been self financing, even with the cheap deal on the ground (though I am willing to be proved wrong).

Going back to the Academy set up, I believe there is greater opportunity for youngsters to develop than with the old reserve set up. Playing against other Academy sides (some stronger, some weaker) gives an opportunity for lads to assess their progress against others of a similar age and also gives the opportunity for" lateral movement" between clubs at the end of The Academy term.
The reserves in Busters time were self funding even having to pay to use the pitch and extra when floodlights were required. They were the most successful team (Reserves) for many seasons thanks to a great bunch of parents/volunteers/ sponsors and of course players.
Title: Re: u21/RESSIES
Post by: KES80 on June 11, 2021, 10:25:25 PM
That's great to hear GC and I am very happy to be corrected on that point.

However, it isn't the way clubs in the NL are going and there must be good reason for that....and of course there is the issue of the pitch at The Walks apparently not now being available for the ressies
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